Shane Geoghegan Murdered in Limerick

 Posted by on November 10, 2008  Add comments
Nov 102008
 

Update 23rd March 2011.   Jury fails to agree on murder charge.

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Dear God.

On the night we host a rugby international in our town, and welcome thousands of visitors to our magnificent new stadium, what happens?

That’s right. Some low-life, inbred, criminal parasites once more touch us with their kiss of hopelessness. These tinkers shot and killed Shane Geoghegan, a well-known local rugby player, as he made his way home at four in the morning.

Why?

Because, we’re told, they mistook him for a rival scumbag, living at the taxpayer’s expense in Shane’s decent, hardworking neighbourhood.

Why do we put up with this? Why does the State put up with this?

Why do we house these people? Why do we feed these people? Why do we accord them any rights at all?

If a foreign country sent agents to defy our police, to sneer at our courts and to murder our people, would we worry about their rights?

We would not.

We’d fling them in a camp to rot, and we’d set dogs on them if they tried to escape.

Do you think these home-grown criminals are any better? Do you think they pose less of a threat to our democracy than some foreign saboteur? Well, if you think that, you’re misguided. Our country is getting to the point where empty-headed teenaged morons are laughing at our ineffectual police force and our impotent politically-correct criminal procedures.

Where are we going? Where is our government going?

I listened to our local Minister today on the radio, the great Willie O Dea, and Willie said Blah blah blah blah, blah blah blah. Which roughly translates into, I’m a useless, self-important, intellectually-bankrupt prick with no idea what’s going on or how to deal with it.

Then I heard the Minister for Justice saying Blah blah blah blah, blah blah blah, which translates into I’m another useless, self-important prick with even less idea what’s going on than that fool O Dea.

God help us, what are we going to do when people like this are in charge of the country? Idiots. They have no idea, and neither do the corrupt, lazy, incompetent, cowardly police who seem at their happiest when they’re bullying honest citizens like you and me. You won’t see those boys in a rush to confront real criminals, let me tell you.

We’re screwed. With half-witted politicians and a broken police force, who is going to stop the low-lifes from doing as they please with the country?

……

You can light a candle for Shane HERE

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Televised appeal HERE. See if there’s anything you can do to help the investigation.

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Shane’s friends remember him in this video.

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Funeral Arrangements

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Also on Bock
Housing a Scumbag
Get Out Of My Town

Irish Criminals : Enemies of the State
Living on Planet Welfare
Knackers
Polish Man Murdered In Dublin

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Elsewhere

Reflective: Conan Drumm

Considered : Howard Town Brewery

Shameful : Branedy

Friends: Munsterfans

papers: Barry Duggan writes

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  129 Responses to “Shane Geoghegan Murdered in Limerick”

Comments (129)
  1.  

    I’m with you all the way Bock but a couple of questions – how can a force equipped with pepper spray tackle loons out of their head on Coke and armed with semi-automatics? On the rare occasions when they do actually shoot one of these vile creatures the bleeding hearts will start crying about the erosion of democracy and police brutality! Oh and civil rights! What civil rights was Shane Geoghegan accorded? IMHO if you cary a gun then you are liable to be shot by the gardai and there is no need for any further investigation – Live by the sword die by the sword!

  2.  

    This so-called “war” should never have got this far. I’ve always thought an innocent bystander would eventually get hit by a stray bullet. This should be the last straw, but sadly it won’t.
    I also feel that seeing as these people have no regard for the Civil Rights of the rest of us then they should be accorded none.
    I have a little story that relates to what you say about the police being afraid of these scum. Back in August my uncle was over from Canada. We had a couple of earky evening pints in Nancys. As we were walking down Cruises street afterwards some of this element of our society, 4 girls aged 15/16 were walking ahead of us. Two guards were walking towards us. The girls started to shout abuse at the two guards, c***s, pigs, etc.. .
    My uncle turned to me and asked was it just him or did the two guards have frightened looks on their faces. I said I was thinking the exact same thing..
    That said it all to me… A small section of our society has this power(for want of a better word) over the rest of us and the people employed to protect us can’t even do what they are paid to do.
    I fell very sad for Shane and all his family.

  3.  

    Shane is another in a sad list of innocent victims of the scum that deals drugs in this city. The guards are powerless against them and the justice system also seems to care more about people that dont pay their licence fees than the scum drug dealers. There is another group that should share in this murder and that is Limericks drug users. They are the people that create the demand and provide the cash for these animals to buy their weapons and rage their wars. My sympathies to Shane’s family and friends.

  4.  

    Bock,Paddy,Pello,I couldn’t put it any better. Not sure about arming the cops though.It wouldn’t change anything.Such a sad,disgusting episode in this town where the finest of people are losing any sense of security,feelgood and pride.My deepest sympathies to Shane’s family and all the decent people in this town.

  5.  

    10 years for anybody caught in possession of a gun would be a good start.

  6.  

    ‘virtually certain’ result of the perpetrator’s act and the perpetrator realises that death or serious injury is a virtually certain result.
    In other words malice aforethought… is it not reasonable to assume that anyone of these people carrying a gun is a potential murderer, why are we putting up with this lawlessness.
    Lip service is no longer an option!

  7.  

    it’s just awful that an innocent person was gunned down like that.
    Slightly on an tangent….. anyone noticed the amount of ‘reshuffling’ going on within the Gardai in Limerick! It’s been done very discreetly and quietly. Just the ‘odd’ bit in the media here and there, about so and so moving or so and so getting a promotion etc and moving on.

  8.  

    My deepest sympathies to the Geoghegan family.

    Bock, I don’t understand the constant ridiculing of the Gardaí? Surely, however bad things are, you realise they are the thin blue line between us and these sponging scumbags? Sure, they’re not perfect but what barrel doesn’t have its rotten apples? If they are ineffectual, then the fault lies with the legal system.

    As the son of an X-Garda, if I had a bullet for every time he returned (dejected and disillusioned as the system allowed more lowlifes back onto the streets) from the days he had to give evidence in court saying, the law is geared toward protecting the criminal, I’d have enough ammunition to take on these pricks myself.

    Unlike the scum, the Gardaí­ have to work within the law, surely we should be supporting them by voting for less useless politicians who will change the law and get some measure of control over these types.

    What would you have them do?

  9.  

    My deepest sympathies for the family of Shane. At the risk of being unpopular, the last police force in the world (and I include the police force of the DRC in that) that I would arm, is the Gardai Siochana. No matter what weapons you give to the police, the criminals can always find better ones and if you give the guards guns, we will end up being shot for drunk and disorderly.
    I mean absolutly no offence to Shane or his family and friends, or do I in any way seek to excuse his killers, but I think that moves toward heightened security forces would inevitably end up as being moves against our own liberties.
    That which you do to the least of my brothers, you do to me
    (I feel) You cannot legislate against a mentality. Our only hope (I believe) is to educate, inform and offer other solutions to a generation that sees this way of life as an option.
    All of this is of little consolation to a berieved mother, i know (or rather i would hope never to really know) but all this talk of arming the police makes me think twice. Feel free to tear me to pieces.

  10.  

    I agree with Virgin. Change is not sitting back waiting for a scene to unfold, it is action, it is a hard demanding road. A path of commitment and heartbreak. Ask yourself what am I going to do about it. Yes you.

  11.  

    -Virgin
    Re-reading my comment, I realise that I have over generalised about the guards. I know the majority of them are good people, who watched Starski & Hutch and want to make a difference and serve the public good, but, as has been observed time and time again, that minority of what could only be described as cold blooded, power tripping cunts are more than happy to show their destain for the rights of the public. Perhaps if we could eliminate that rotten core of our police force, it would find itself free-er to tackle this problem with the tools at hand, and some tightening of the penal laws to prevent what you described above.

  12.  

    My deepest sympathy to the Geoghegan family.

    I agree with most of the comments already made. However, rather than confine these comments to the pages of bocktherobber (no offence at all intended bock), perhaps these comments should also be sent to our Justice Minister at info@justice.ie, he needs to be inundated with angry responses from our city. it may be a pointless excerise but surely is better than nothing. If you do chose to email the Minister I suggest you also cc the email to our own Willie O Dea at webmaster@defence.ie

  13.  

    I understand the outrage but it will all come to nothing because the civil liberties of the criminals are more protected than the civil liberties of the Shane Geoghegans of this world, God rest him and comfort his family. I personally would have no objection to being challenged and having to produce ID or putting up with other inconveniences if it meant that the lives of innocent people were made more safe. But at the mention of bringing in special laws the majority will go off on ‘we’re no better than the British’ rants and the Shinners Shapeshifters will think all their birthdays have come at once and we’ll have more to fear than the drug barons and their murdering zombies. A long long long way down the road, when many more like Shane have died, we will, deeply unpleasant though it is, have nothing left to turn to but capital punishment.

  14.  

    With the mood I’m in right now, savage and atavistic though it might appear, I wouldn’t mind seeing a few of these fuckers hanging from lamp-posts.

  15.  

    I’m sorry to say it , but we are fucked , truly , we are fucked , the police are afraid , the government don’t care , we will have the usual media circus for a week or 2 , the guards might get a tip off or get lucky , and eventually find the scum who murdered shane . the reason we are in this mess is because people walk out of prison 8 yrs after killing someone , it just costs too much to keep murderers in jail , i say hang the bastards !

  16.  

    There’s no doubt, in the current difficult times, it would certainly be the cheaper option.

  17.  

    bock + fred : i’ll help you kick the stools from under them if you want.

    I cannot begin to comprehend what the geoghan family must be going through today but my thoughts are with them.

  18.  

    Where are these apes getting the guns?

  19.  

    Hanging solves the revenge side of the argument but at what price to ourselves.

    Why not go back to basics and strip the prisons of everything but the 4 bare walls and a ream of butchers paper to each prisoner for arse wiping.
    No TV’s, no radios, no smokes, no nothing. If they climb on the roof to protest – leave them there.
    A bed to lie on, a toilet to sit on and nothing else. They’ve broken the rules of decent and civilised society so do the time in minimalist comfort.
    Fuck rehabilitation. Make the prison system so cold no one would dream of coming back.
    3 basic meals a day. No mixing with others. 23 hour lock up, 1 hours exercise doing laps of the yard. No talking. Glass separation at visits.

    Am I being too hard?

  20.  

    does outlawery still exist in ireland? could we not call these gang members outlaws? would be a lot easier to deal with them then, as they would have no civil rights to violate.

  21.  

    snookertony: good idea. and when their sentence is finished take away all social welfare benefits so they are forced to get off their arses and do something…

  22.  

    When I lived in Ireland limerick to me was the ideal spot to stop for lunch and a pint when on my way to beautiful Claire. Now I think I would drive on through—–sad

  23.  

    It might be wishful thinking, but I suspect Shane Geoghegan’s murder will trigger a Veronica Guerin type reaction and bring an end to all this.

  24.  

    Bock, your wanting to see them hanging from lamposts is understandable outrage, anger and your passionate wish that this absolutely horrific act doesn’t happen to someone else. And yeah, I feel that anger too, that “What I wouldn’t want to do to those ..” feeling.

    But … that’s why we have laws, to prtect ourselves from our own, human revenge instincts. A lynching isn’t justice – beating up some killers isn’t justice either.

    I’m with JOhn Wayne above – ten years for possession of a gun. You could put a lot of these absolute low-life killers-for-hire away that way.

    We’re angry – we’re fucking angry, in fact – but we can’t let that mess up our tenuous justice system. We, or our kids, or our kids’ friends might all need some civil rights one day,

  25.  

    My deepest sympathies to Shane Geoghegan’s family, his friends and acquaintances.

    It’s worth asking who’s in charge here, because it certainly is not the law makers or the law enforcers. Indeed it appears to me that the Gardai are dancing to a tune set by the lawmakers and the lawbreakers.

    Only two nights ago I was issued with a ‘Caution’ by two gardai who came to my door over a confrontation I was involved with. This confrontation involved two utter scumbags – or in tabloid-speak: “persons known to the gardai” who man-handled me when I was providing protection for my daughter.

    The two gardai were, I must admit, apologetic and agreed that it was all meant to intimidate me. They also agreed that if I attempted to use the gardai in like manner I would be given short shrift and told to fuck off.

    The situation I see is that scumbags can avail of the gardai and ordinary citizens can go fuck themselves.

    Once again my deepest sympathies to Shane’s family and friends and everyone in Limerick.

  26.  

    I think, ‘Irish Criminals: Enemy of the State’, was the first of Bock’s pieces that I read. It’s worth revisiting in light of the murder of Shane Geoghegan, Go mbua Dia leis.
    I read recently about two thugs in Dublin who turned up to ‘de arrest’ one of their buddies. Anyway, the sub-plot and very little play made of it, I might add, is that a Ban Garda locked herself in the squad car while two of her colleagues, one a student Garda were getting the crap kicked out of them outside. If that was some big ‘culchie’ Garda he’d have been ostracised and then kicked out… but a Ban Garda and a minority to boot – no chance, they’ll probably give her a fucking medal or worse, send her to Limerick.

  27.  

    The policy of Limerick City Council purchasing houses for scumbags and their families out in the community at large in the middle of suburbia trying to “Spread the Problem” or move it out of their back door has come back to haunt us in the most awful way possible.

    People used to complain about the loss of value of their houses without thinking about any other ramifications. We can now tragically see the end result of such policies. Simply put, The intended target was placed into the heart of this suburban estate by the Housing Section of the City Council with tragic consequences.

    Now they are not solely at fault.
    It has got to the stage that the bleeding heart, “issues around” politically correct crowd have diluted the effect of Prisons over the years by crying about “Prisoners Rights” to the extent that Prison is actually a damn sight better way to live for most of these thugs. I’m sick of hearing how these people need to be helped and loved rather than locked away in an empty cell for the rest of their lives. Life imprisonment should mean exactly that, we took away the death penalty because it could mean the death of innocents, but we have failed to replace it with an effective deterrent. I am somewhat at a loss as to how we proceed from here but I wish to propose the following as one way to move on:

    The blood of this innocent man is on the hands of scumbags supported by John Devane and his ilk. Talks of truces and the like give these bastards a stature, recognition, a forum that they do not deserve. I agree with an earlier Bock post that these bottom feeders need now to be crushed and I feel that the only answer now is to give anyone with gangland connections a week to give themselves up before handing the whole show over to some special unit, the ERU, Cab or the army to deal with once and for all.

    I know it sounds drastic but it has gone to such an extreme that drastic measures are needed. The guards know who these people are but are ineffectual and powerless to deal with them on their own under the current system. Draconian powers need to be given to a select hand picked crew with the sole purpose of putting these people out of business and taking them out of circulation once and for all. If it means bringing in outsiders to do this job because our own are unwilling/unable to do the job then so be it. Give them a week to come in willingly or face serious consequences, including the possibility of dying while being taken in. I was of the opinion that all human life is sacred but these bastards do not have the right to be called human. By participating in the so called “Business” that they have and by conducting that business in the manner that they have, they have now forfeited those rights.

    I apologise for such a disjointed post but I’m still sickened and to be honest angry. I knew the lad, played against him a few times over the years before I retired from the game.

    This has to come to an end, now. It’s just a pity that it may have taken the death of this man to finally bring us to our senses.

  28.  

    The Gardai are doing their level best in difficult circumstances. Their hands are tied due to the constitution legislating heavily in favour of the accused on top of an overly philosophical judiciary who seem bent on preserving a revolving door prison system which has scumbags wearing three years inside like a badge of honor.

    What we are seeing now is the tail end of Heir McDowell’s tough new legislating while failing time and time again to impliment the laws already in place. This problem can be solved in two easy steps.

    1. You still have a right to silence. However, the prosecution reserves the right to infer guilt from your refusal to account.

    2. Start handing down fifty year sentences. It might not make them think twice, but it will certainly stop them from acting twice.

    RIP Shane. You’ll be sadly missed.

  29.  

    No, snookertony you are not being too hard. Fuck rehabilitation you say, but as far as I’m concerned criminals are much more likely to go straight coming out of one of your prisons than they are currently. and it would be much more affordable. The inmates in Limerick prison get sky TV, pay per view events, and no, not one one TV between them, they have one in each cell. This was justified on the airwaves by the bizarre rationale that it was cheaper to give them what they want than to have them fighting over what to watch, which would involve paying prison officers overtime to stop the fights.

    This is the mentality you are up against. But its not just our prisons that are the problem, its the courts and the Guards as well. We need to clean up the Gardai, so that we can give them the powers they need to be effective, without fear of those powers being abused. We need a major overhaul of the courts, sentencing guidelines to be followed and delays to be eliminated. There is no need to start eroding our rights by bringing in internment or any patriot act style measures. Fix the justice system, enforce the laws, clean up and empower the Gardai. Of course that would require long term thinking, and as this tragedy will not be front page in two weeks, the pols and commissioner will attend the funeral of this poor innocent victim, utter a few pieties and platitudes, and that will be it.

  30.  

    Bock, it might sound like a crazy idea but I think we should be able to revoke the citizenship of the people involved, drop in them a currach outside our territorial waters and let them row to some place that will take them. Citizenship comes with responsibilities as well as rights.

  31.  

    @Great Zucchini.

    Excellent post, I share your anger and disillusion.

    Its time war was declared by the State on these people.

    And those who support them by buying their socially acceptable little snifter of white powder will have to decide who they would rather hold the reins of power. Unpleasant a fact as it may be to them, people who use a little bit of coke or so-called ‘soft’ drugs are funding cunts like the Dundons just as much as any heroin addict is.

  32.  

    I think it is the sentencing system in Ireland, particularly in relation to violent crime, that urgently needs a complete overhaul.
    1. A life sentence should mean a minimum of 25-30 years behind bars with no chance of parole.
    2. Concurrent sentencing is an absolute joke. All crimes should have an individual sentence and time should be served for each conviction. If one is convicted of a stabbing incident whilst commiting a robbery then that should be treated as two crimes with consecutive sentences.
    3. What is the point of a judge issuing a sentence of 10 years and suspending the final three? That is not a 10 year sentence it’s a 7 year one so why not call it that?
    3. All crimes involving any type of weapon should have a minimum 10 year sentence, no parole.
    4. Jails should be what they were always meant to be – places of punishment. Persons convicted of violent crimes should not be allowed have any extra comforts eg tv, video games in their cells.
    5. Youths convicted of first time offences could be given the choice of either jail time or equivalent community service in impoverished or calamity stricken country. It may instil a sense of caring into them whilst also getting them away from peer pressure.
    6. Those with multiple previous convictions should have progressively longer sentences similar to the three strikes and you’re out system in the United States.
    The murder this weekend of a totally innocent,
    law abiding and much loved man may be the catalyst that is needed to finally get to grips with these vicious crime gangs.
    My deepest condolences to the family and friends of Shane.

  33.  

    A little bit of imagination would go a long way towards cost effectiveness in our prisons. give them a form on the way in, asking “what can you do?” “what skills do you have?” etc. If they can do something of value (REAL monetary value, not putting on a bloody play to expand the other prisoners appreciation of art), let them do it for 8 hours a day. The ones with no worthwhile skills can do useful drudgework of some kind (prisons could do contract assembly line work). Its not inconceivable that this work could fully cover the cost of the incarceration, assuming of course the athletics tracks, gymnasiums, trips to the cinema and sky tv are taken away or not provided in the first place, and the prisoners are exempted from minimum wage. Oh, and if we have signed some international human rights thing that stops us from doing it, then we unsign it, a la GW Bush and Kyoto. It really isnt rocket science, and politically would be (that rare thing) both sensible and popular.

  34.  

    Just to repeat what most of you are saying here, the punishment dosen’t fit the crime. I think that life should mean life, strip their cell’s a bed and a toilet, if they have any kind of skills they should use them in prison if they don’t let them break rocks give them something else to think about other than running their empire’s from their cell’s, complete seperation from their visitors and if the prision officers think that there has been anything handed over to them a cavitiy serch should be in order, don’t think they will try to sneak anything else in when the biggest prision officers put those gloves on.

  35.  

    Bock, I was going to comment here but ended up writing a piece on my own blog. Looks like your readers want internment brought in.

  36.  

    As you can see, Conan, people here in Limerick are very angry.

  37.  

    This murder has left me sick, utterly sick to my stomach. Like everyone here I very much value the fact that I grew up in a low crime country and I am outraged, more than I have been about anything else in my life, that a combination of political correctness, incompetence and stupidity is allowing parts of our precious cities to be turned over to these worthless sacks of shit.

    I am from Dublin and like Limerick certain parts of my city have been ruined by soulless bastards who think they own these areas, and the people who live in them. But firstly let me say that I know Limerick well, I have lots of friends from Limerick and i still love it as a city. Its a wonderful place, full of great characters and you are lucky in that the good of Limerick outnumber these fucks by 10,000 to 1.

    The problem as I see it is this. This country is totally paralysed by political correctness. As a result the pathetic politicians in charge of Justice over the last number of years have been unwilling to do what is needed to take these waste’s of human skin out. Ahern and co don’t have the guts to do what is right because they fear it might not go down well among the pc elitists. If you listen to vincent browne five nights a week on tv3 he thinks crime is a figment of our imagination. He was against the formation of the CAB. He thinks its unconstitutional for the state to seize the assets of criminals. Joe Higgans blames it all on corrupt politicians and businessmen as if the fact that we have corruption in this country somehow gets these guys off the hook.

    We all know what we need. We need aggressive proactive anti criminal legislation that makes it impossible for these guys to operate. We need a massive change in our justice system which is so amateurish its become a total farce. But we wont get it unless we demand it. The main stream media in Ireland is infected with this pc disease but the blogosphere is not. This fine blog like many others tells it like it is. We need to challenge all the fuck wits who say its our fault for neglect or not hugging these people enough or whatever. The state did not fail these people. They have failed us. We don’t owe them anything and they need to be taken out.

    I am not a fool. I know if you come from certain parts of Dublin or Limerick it can be difficult to avoid getting inolved in crime. But its not difficult to avoid getting involved in this sort of organised murder. This is new. This is people trying to intoduce a new level of violence into our society and make it the norm. We absolutely must stamp it out. It is the number 1 responsability of the state to protect its people. We must put pressure on them to do so.

    Apologies for the lenght of my rant but like everyone I am just so horrified by this. May he rest in peace.

  38.  

    Perhaps instead of complaining, maybe limerick should stop RE-electing Willie O Dea. Sounds like a useful first step?

  39.  

    I can understand the anger, Bock. But we’ve had bad legislation brought in in anger before and it did fuck all good.

  40.  

    It seems to me the good legislation wasn’t much use either.

  41.  

    Branedy, you are now getting to the heart of the matter, we keep electing the same crowd, who are completely averse to the kind of bold radical reform that is needed, who lack the determination which is needed to cut through all the crap (legal obstacles, vested interests etc) and get the system working. If someone wanted to stand for election on a “Fix Our Justice System” platform, someone with ability, drive and passion, who could get things done, would any of the main parties have him? My guess is no, they’d probably think he was a bit of a looney, a loose cannon. He’d have to stand as an independent, probably get portrayed as a looney fascist by the media, and get a couple of hundred votes. We get the government we deserve.

  42.  

    @Branedy, happy to oblige, Mr. Doublequota O’D might stut-stut-stutter his way in again – I have no doubt his acolytes will still manage to get the willie in for another people-fuck, but next time without that coat-hanger Peter Power. Who knows though, the electorate might finally begin to realise just what a useless and ineffectual cretin he has always been. Willie always has put his Party loyaty before any comitment to the people he claims to represent.

    But let’s hope along with that, the rest of the country ceases re-electing Fianna Fáilure full stop.

    @ Ted, Political correctness in this country is as dangerous as any drug. Its proponents the most myopic crowd of limp-wristed idiots ever to walk the earth. Well said.

  43.  

    Before agreeing too much with Branedy, you might want to know that he still hasn’t retracted his slur against the memory of Shane Geoghegan HERE.

    UPDATE: Branedy subsequently retracted his comments and apologised.

  44.  

    Dear Bock, My deepest sympathy to Shane’s family and friends. Here in the US our police force are armed, as you know, sadly all too well.

    Honestly, when our police forces are not killing the Irish, they are trying to do their best to protect us. Yet we have lost many innocent bystanders to gang and drug related activities.

    We have lost children, (just by their being in their homes, sitting at the table and doing homework), we have also lost athletes, and many other innocents, due to the stray bullets of gangs seeking revenge, and the wonderful world of drugs.

    Is it just the sign of the times. how shall we protect our children and grand children from these lower then scum elements?? Perhaps it is time for the taxing paying citizens the world over to carry guns, but the low life would always have the bigger weapons so to speak.

    I am at a loss, words cannot solve these issues. My values are life and peace, but I do believe that there are crimes that deserve the lamp post treatment, and drugs and gangs fit that criteria.

  45.  

    This is f*cking tragic by any standards, the fact as well it was a case of mistaken identity makes it worse.

    I didn’t know the fellow involved but by all accounts he was a nice guy who paid tax for the priviledge that scumbags could live for free where he presumably worked his arse off for the privledge of doing so.

    I live in a small town in Mayo and the HSE has recently seen fit to house approximately 7 scobe families from Dublin & Limerick. The more worrying part was that my cousin from Limerick identified two of them from his days being a doorman in Limerick as being “dirty scumbag f*ckers”.

    Sure every bleeding heart liberal will say well where are they supposed to live?? Here’s me working my arse off in an economy which is getting tighter and tighter, I don’t see any government body trying to make life any better for me.

    We had a few of them up around our house one night snooping around, called the guards (this is Padraic Nally country) and they said they would look into it. About 3 hours later a squad car drove past, I’d say that showed them…

    Sorry for rant, bull thick and absolutely fucking disgusted with the state of this country. Emigration is looking like a very appealing prospect.

    My condolences to the friends and family of Shane, I and hope to God at least something good comes of it.

  46.  

    In my comment, I did not properly extend my deepest sympathies to Andrew Hanlon’s family. The loss of their son due to our police force in the US carrying a gun, is tragic beyond words. Forgive me.

  47.  

    My idea ( long held ) is extreme but extreme measures are essential. Define the word scumbag and then chemically castrate all offenders. Problem solved in one generation. In reference to a previous comment a growing number of gardai seem to be taking out their feeling of impotence, in dealing with scum, on law abiding citizens who they know they can bully. If only the immense anger being displayed in Limerickthis week could be chanelled in some way to positively impact on this horrendous situation. One thing for certain the politicians will huff and they’ll puff but fuck-all will be blown down.

  48.  

    Brian —

    Fucking bastards. Let’s expose this bullshit for what it is.

    Unprofessional statistics-driven police, happier to stop you for having no light on your bike than to confront a murdering tinker bastard. Stupid newly-recruited police-girls delighted to bully a pub-owner for serving drink ten minutes after hours. Idiot farm-boys drooling with pleasure when they stop a drunk blundering towards the taxi-rank. Anything to avoid confronting real criminals.

    A disgrace.

  49.  

    I once lay on the street outside a well known city hotel, nine shades of shit being kicked out of me, for no fucking reason whatsoever other than I happened to be there, while two gardai in their squad car sat smiling out at me from across the street. True story.

    After the first gang of fuckwits had tired of me, the two in the squad car drove off.

    At least I survived. My deepest sympathy to Shane’s Family, Girlfriend and His many friends who must all be in shock.

  50.  

    On behalf of myself and the Family of Andrew-James Hanlon who was murdered in the USA in June, we would like to convey our deepest sympathies.

    We understand the loss and pain you are going through more than most.

    Our thoughts and prayers are with you at this difficult time.

    May God be with you and Shane.

    Once again an innocent man and his family are being made suffer needlessly for the shameless actions of a ruthless thug.

  51.  

    Diarmuid Scully on Live95 FM this morning made it even plainer. Use the existing legislation, name the gangs as subversive organisations dangerous to the state and let the commissioner put these people directly into jail on his word.

    I’d add the following : like I said earlier, Give them the week to come in voluntarily and then (I’m changing my mind on this one) set the Irish Rangers on them. They would be particularly good at taking down these gangs. We don’t actually need to go outside the country for people to take them down. From what I understand about the rangers, they train the SAS in various aspects of Warfare, as well as other special forces around the world. Naming these bastards as Subversives would allow the Army to be called in to deal with them.

    Forget arming Gaurds, let the experts deal with these scum. Cut the heads from these organisations in one operation and then work your way down along until there is none left to carry on. The gobshites whose money keeps these scum in business will just have to do without their fix.

  52.  

    My heart goes out to the family and friends of Shane. I cant even begin to comprehend the nightmare they are going through.
    The criminals who did this are soulless evil garbage. They have no fear of the Gardai, prison, or the state. But then why would any criminal be afraid of the law nowadays? Even the most horrendous crime of murder merely ensures a bed in luxury accommodation. Every luxury you could want… and you probably wont do more than 8 years… you can network away while you are there…. you can join a gym and become tougher and fitter. You can run your drugs business just as well… you will not have to pay taxes, or electricity bills or tv licenses or food bills…. sure tis the lap of luxury. You can have free access to medical dental and all types of health care…
    PLEASE MAKE PRISON REAL.
    Violent Criminals, drug dealers and those who peddle death and all associated with them should lose all entitlements and liberties.
    Prison should not be comfortable or easy. It should be a punishment.
    We need the 3 strike rule.
    We need gun possession to be a 10 year sentence with no early releases.
    Much longer sentences for murder.
    The government could save all the money it needs for the economy by cutting out all luxuries in prisons and making prisoners do hard labour.
    It may well be the first time in their lives that some of these scum ever do a days work.
    AS A NATION WE NEED TO WAKE UP
    things are going to get worse unless someone takes a firm grip of the prison and legal system and shakes them up.

  53.  

    Tinkers is that not a racist term.I agree but will the P C want you done for racism?Put this post up if you have any guts.For once i agree with you.

  54.  

    These low-life scumbag knackers contribute nothing but misery to people in Limerick and elsewhere. When they start to target the political class I bet there’ll be action.

  55.  

    No, Kate. It isn’t a racist term. Tinkers are not a race.

    What do you mean by “done”?

  56.  

    I think its about tax paying people give these behind the gun scumbags a lesson ourselves. Join togather on each estate and fuck them back to where they came from. If the law cannot do it then we have to there is 99 of us to each scumbag in limerick – come on the decent people of limerick

  57.  

    Ourselves — If your name is a subtle hint at Sinn Féin, you came to the wrong place.

  58.  

    Wouldn’t that be great!

    I can guarantee you though that vigilanteism (I can’t spell) would be met with a lot more force by gardaí than these ‘career’ criminals are.

    They’re wiping their holes with the constitution, those living within the law are those most at it’s mercy, there’s a lot to be said for going on the dole. Paying tax and having a fixed address seems to be a big crime around these parts.

    Speaking of which I am expecting a 200 euro fine for being caught in a pub after hours, everyone in there was employed and tax payers. Nobody was rude and everyone cooperated fully with the guards, who still felt the need to talk to us like we were children. If I was some knack and told them to f*ck off, you can be sure I would be hurried out the door (if even) and that would be the last I would hear of it.

  59.  

    sorry about the name but its nothing to do with them scumhead so called political irish party – its about us law abiding citizens who have to live in fear beside these lazy weak shitheads

  60.  

    First of all, my deepest sympathy to Shane’s family, God only knows the hurt they must be feeling. Reading your blog and the comments being made I found it rather ironic(& amusing)
    that internment is being advocated, I thought that kind of thing was only done by the British !! I have always thought that internment was the only answer to the scumbag regime that exists in Limerick. However, when the subject was mentioned I was condemned as an English bastard. Funny how the wheel turns !!

  61.  

    There’s one difference. The internment you’re talking about arose from profound political differences, whereas the scumbags in question here have no principles or beliefs whatever.

  62.  

    Maybe interment would be more appropriate than internment..and a lot cheaper.

  63.  

    This is a social problem. These criminal gangs are in operation because they supply a product that many of the so-called law-abiding tax-payers demand. Categorizing them as subversives, taking away their civil rights, internment, extermination – will that solve the issue? How many of you, hand on heart, can say that you never once experimented with an illegal substance?

    If radical measures are required, I propose the legalisation/regulation of recreational drugs. There is great hypocrisy in the law concerning the use of legal/illegal recreational drugs in most countries currently. There is no good reason, for instance, why tobacco should be legal while cannabis should not.

    While I do not condone drug use, the current situation clearly demonstrates that the ‘war on drugs’ is almost completely ineffectual and all at the tax-payers expense. According to the U.N. the illegal drug trade is worth $420 billion per annum. This industry is completely unregulated, un-taxed, and lining the pockets of criminals such as those who ended Shane’s life last weekend.

    Surely this option should be on the table. Taking away their business as opposed to their rights/lives. Something needs to change. Whatever it is, I hope it’s not done in futility.

  64.  

    What bothers me is that the guards KNOW who killed Shane Geoghegan, they also KNOW who the real target is. (He has been targeted before….its only a matter of time for him)
    So, am I being naieve or why dont they just lift the guys who did this? Throw them into prison. Let them prove their innocence, not have innocence presumed for them.
    But I agree with snookeerTony….no fancy, cushy, prison. Just the bare essentials.
    It doesnt really matter whether they are cold or hungry in there. What? I hear you say….what about their human rights…..I hear you say?

    Where were Shane Geoghegan’s human rights as he walked home on a cold, dark, night?

    FR

  65.  

    Eliminate supply and demand has to falter. Remove suppliers and police the users. The gardai need to start arresting drug dealers and users…. those visiting the likes of night clubs .. the middle and upper class socialites… those who hold private drugs parties in areas where houses are priced like telephone numbers. The scum who murder to keep their dirty drugs cartels going are only half the problem. Those safe secure users who publicly hold down respectable jobs but who privately abuse drugs for their own entertainment are responsible too. Anyone who uses illegal drugs is equally responsible for drug related crime. Drug users are the silent partners in drug crime.

  66.  

    Every human being should have the right to put whatever he/she wants into his/her own body, as long as it does not impact negatively on the life of another human being. The fact that our government does not facilitate this basic human right is what has led to the situation we see today with prohibition, and the feuding gangs that make massive profits from the sale of this much sought-after commodity.

    When you criminalise something that isn’t a real crime, you still end up with real criminals

  67.  

    Jumper and Alorah —

    You don’t get it, do you?

    All these handy, pre-formed opinions, completely missing the point.

    Listen, have you any idea what you’re dealing with here? These people are complete psychopaths who don’t need the drugs business to be dangerous. These fuckers would be dangerous if there was no such thing as illegal drugs.

    These people would happily kill you for fun.

    Grasp that, and forget about Joe Duffy’s Liveline certainties. This is not Sociology 101. This is reality.

  68.  

    Bock, do you live in any one of the estates where these gangs reside? Have you encountered any of the gang members first-hand?

    I do, and I have. I haven’t claimed to be certain about anything here. My opinion is based mostly on experience.

    I lived and still live next door to them. I went to school with some of them. I played soccer on the street with them when I was younger.

    On the contrary, I think it may be you who has the handy, pre-formed opinions. Happily kill me for fun, would they?

    On what have you based your opinion?

  69.  

    Sorry. I was wrong. They’re harmless, honest drug-dealers who wouldn’t dream of hurting anyone outside their business.

    Some of them even help old people cross the street.

    Silly me.

  70.  

    Really Bock. Sarcasm is the lowest form of wit.

  71.  

    No it’s not.

  72.  

    Brock. You know that old addage – actions speak louder than words.

    Well, here’s a mad idea. Since you like to harp on and berate our elected officials and police force so much, why don’t you and your supporters above do something about it?

    You guys seem to talk the talk.

    Surely it wouldn’t take much effort on your collective part to put a stop to these “low-life”, “inbred” “parasites.” These “semi-literate” “tinkers”. These “scumbags”.

    Or, perhaps you could just type an anonymous blog complaining about it but, y’know, not actually do anything.

    Oh, I sure hope that was a left-over Haloween banger I just heard going off outside. Can’t be too sure these days.

  73.  

    You seem to be defending these drug-dealing, low-life, inbred, tinker, parasite, semi-literate, scumbag drug dealers.

    Or am I mistaken?

  74.  

    You are mistaken. I do not defend them for a second. What annoys me is some of the absolutely ridiculous opinions expressed by some people. Those who say, “We know who did it. The Guards know who did it. Why don’t they just lock them up?” etc etc. Ok then. Who did it? Who pulled the trigger?

    It’s very easy to post your thoughts on the Internet about what should be done. About what the Government should do. About what the Gardaí should do. The difficult part is for you to actually do something about it.

    My comments here were solely to highlight what I believe to be the root cause of the problems we face today as regards these gangs. And that’s prohibition. It hasn’t worked in the past. It’s not working now. And I can’t see it working anytime soon.

  75.  

    I’m not disagreeing with you on that. In my opinion, these people would be violent criminals with or without drugs.

    The identity of the shooter is also incidental to this discussion.

    Solving this crime won’t save a single life. Shooters are easily hired, I understand.

  76.  

    The legalisation argument is one that does indeed deserve great merit, but I don’t believe for one second that the behaviour of these people is strictly determined by this specific ‘market’.

    I’m sure that if drugs were legalised they would find some other way to extort money or kick society in the bollocks.

    Also I have to agree with those who blame also users, I have the same argument with a lot of my friends who are ‘social’ users. If you’re buying drugs (under current legislation) you may as well be giving these killers a tug, you pay for their guns and you pay for their bullets.

    I’m waiting to hear the outcome of the big meeting on the ‘gangland issue’, I am pretty sure though it will be either draconian and impractical, or will do f*ck all and give solid arguments to all sides that somehow everyone is the real victim here.

  77.  

    No doubt they would still be violent criminals, legalisation or not. But right now, thanks to the laws we have, they are extremely well-funded violent criminals. Perhaps many of you have already seen the Prime Time Investigates special, War Without End. If not, it’s certainly worth a watch. You can view it here:

    http://www.rte.ie/news/primetimeinvestigates/

    Real Player is required.

    Oh, by the way, that Halloween banger I heard going off last night turned out to be a burning car. Probably the petrol tank exploding. It’s a ’97 green VW Polo I think, just in case any of you are missing a car today.

  78.  

    Arresting drug users is certainly not the solution to the problem, they are already being arrested and drug usage continues to increase all over the world.
    I agree prohibition never did and never will
    work. By decriminalising drugs not only will the market immediately disappear for these gangs but millions of Euros and hours of Gardai manpower could be put to use in other more constructive ways. I agree these violent gangs will find other means of generating income but your 16 year old son or daughter will no longer have to interact with them (directly or indirectly) in order to purchase their drugs. And for those who point the finger at illegal drug users as being responsible for the deaths, does not that therefore mean those who choose to dabble in legal drugs i.e. alcohol, are therefore responsible for the deaths caused by drunk drivers? For the record, I choose not to use any drugs including alcohol.

  79.  

    Jumper says “Every human being should have the right to put whatever he/she wants into his/her own body, as long as it does not impact negatively on the life of another human being”
    Who do you propose will sell these toxic drugs? Will you need a prescription? Oh yes , some here think that would cure all society’s ills….. I read above from numbers of bloggers that the criminals would still be criminals because it seems that people here belive its in their nature… so that problem according to that particular train of thought wont go….
    SO lets legalise these highly toxic drugs. Lets have prescriptions for them because they are not really recreational materials. Opiates, Heroin Cocaine are primarily medicines.. YUP. So now we get all the recreational drug users to have their fun on the governments drug scheme.. OH but hang on that wont work either cos guess what the users wont be happy with safe doses… no. TO GET their recreational high they will need much higher doses. SO now we will have addicts on prescription meds they cant get enough of . Health related issues will rocket. OUr hospitals will be filled with persons with Kidney failure, liver failure… WHAT A MESS.
    THESE DRUGS ARE DANGEROUS AND 100%ADDICTIVE .THATS THE PROBLEM.
    GROW UP AND GET REAL.
    But of course the liberals here think they are entitled to put whatever they want into their body/// Great .. FINE .. DO that… Get yourself on a waiting list or a liver or a kidney… jump the queue over people who have not imposed disease on themselves ….. but what would you care after all you are only doing what is your right….
    So much for thinking of others. What a selfish society you are proposing. What a negative view of collective responsibility you must have…
    So OK lets all dose up. to hell with the consequences, sure we’re young. We only live once…

    DO that… wreck your liver and kidneys sozzle your brain…. its just great fun isnt it? But please dont expect tax payers to pay for your hospital beds and treatment. Kill yourselves,just not at everybody elses expense.
    P>S>

  80.  

    We can have a debate about legalising drugs another day, but this post is about Shane Geoghegan’s murder. Please try to keep it on track.

  81.  

    P.S. Jumper says:
    “Every human being should have the right to put whatever he/she wants into his/her own body, as long as it does not impact negatively on the life of another human being.”
    Drugs such as cocaine, herion, crystal meth…. once you start putting these in your system there is no way to avoid the resulting behaviours, paranoias addiction and illness impacting on others. Mostly the people closest to the individual. But also those in the users wider environment… work colleagues, etc. The fact that addicts dont recognise personality changes, aggressiveness, violence paranoia in themselves seems to escape Jumper.
    Try holding a rational conversation with someone who has been a user of hard drugs. Even when they are not high.
    But I suppose their right to do this is all important.???????
    Try deciding which of two patients deserve a liver first… drug addict alcoholic or cancer patient. The persons who did it to themselves through whatever form of addiction dont make it to top of list over the poor joe soap who develops an illness through no fault of his own.

  82.  

    Bock what are you about? Thought this was a discussion and free blog?
    Shane , may he Rest In Peace was murdered by drug barons… who deal in death one way or the other. All my comments apply to drugs whether they are legalised or not. People on this blog have said legalising drugs may stop drug crime. And they feel this is a way to “Fix” a huge problem.
    The debate on the legality of hard drugs is totally relevant to Shane’s death.

  83.  

    No. This is a site I have to run in an orderly manner, and I’m telling you that the subject of legalising drugs is for a different day.

  84.  

    There is nothing disorderly in what I have written. BIt seems the facts of drug use are a bit too real for this page…. Please allow people to address the views projected by numbers of other bloggers on this page about the liberal to legalise hard drugs. Shanes death should not be used by some to promote the legalisation of drugs. Shanes murder shows society what Drug dealers and Drugs are about. If this blog page is to be open truthful and real then Shanes death cannot be isolated from the people who killed him and the stuff they peddle.
    This is my last comment….. . As I would not want to be disorderly… God forbid.

  85.  

    Don’t go throwing hissy-fits here girl. it doesn’t work.

    Respect the wishes of the people who run this site if you want to comment. There are plenty of other places to go if you don’t like the rules here.

  86.  

    No hissy fit at all…. just honest comment….You have allowed comments castigating the gardai, politicians and ordinary decent citizens who dont take drugs etc but you have a difficulty with me responding to comments promoting legalising drugs? Strange… you wrote…”Jumper and Alorah“
    You don’t get it, do you?
    All these handy, pre-formed opinions, completely missing the point.”
    My opinions come from my experiences working with people who have had their lives ruined by drugs. . … you may need to look at your ability to deal with open discussion.

  87.  

    Alorah, I already told you, there will be room for that discussion another day. And I’m telling you now, again, this is not the place for it.

    You seem to be under the illusion that you have complete freedom to post whatever you want here, so I’d better explain something.

    You do not.

    There’s no such thing as freedom of speech on a privately-operated web-site. I decide what goes into it, because I do the hard work and I carry the can if something goes wrong.

    Capiche?

    If you want freedom of speech, you can set up a site of your own.

    Now, let that be an end of it.

  88.  

    Having read other posts I assumed I could comment and I dont think I have written anything offensive illegal or derogatory……. but I respect that you have been straight and have stated to me that there is no such thing as freedom of speech on your site as its your site and that you are deciding what goes onto your site page. Good night.

  89.  

    Well thank God you finally figured out this is a publication like any other. Would you insist that a newspaper print your letters?

  90.  

    No, but then again I doubt many newspapers would print what you have!! Good night Bock.

  91.  

    Sleep well, sweet Alorah!

  92.  

    Bock…In relation to your comments about the police.about 18 moths ago I had a car for sale and remember this new law, no for sale signs on windows. the law was in a few days and i come around the corner and my car is getting towed, i drive up, three fking pigs at the tow truck because that is all i could describe them as. I asked what was going on they said this new law we are going to tow your car 250 to get it back. I asked for a chance to move the car since it was a new law. No was his answer but with an arrogant pig like tone. So then i began my little rant of how murders are walking the streets and drug dealers are driving 4x4s etc and they are breaking my balls about having a 4 sale sign on a car and will not give me a break…no they didn’t like that hearing a bit of truth…so the NCT in my other car was out by a week so they decided to take too..and when i called em bastards while walking away they arrested me..walking away I might add.. twisted my arm up around my back with the rookie laughing…costing me approx 500 quid to get my cars back..I had a good gov job,paid my taxes,not a scum trouble maker…as I said to them at the time big boys picking an easy target…I said go up to southill and take their cars or weston….nawh let them do what they want..lets makes ourselves feel big by harassing the average joe…

  93.  

    alorah, you seem to be getting quite emotional in your offence at the idea of ending prohibition. This is unsurprising, as the ‘prohibition is best’ ideology is almost completely emotionally driven and not based on rational thought. To help you understand where I am coming from, I suggest that you take a serious look at prohibition, from its inception right through to the modern day. Study the evidence. Understand that since its inception, drug use has increased, the availability of drugs has increased, while the price of drugs has fallen, and continues to fall.

    Understand that the UN estimated two years ago that the illegal drug trade was worth $320 billion per annum, second only to the arms trade. No doubt this amount has risen since then, and is entirely in the hands of criminals.

    As a case study, consider the prohibition of alcohol in the US. A black market was created as a result. People weren’t going to give up their booze. Organised criminals filled the shoes of law-abiding publicans. Deadly concoctions were produced in bathtubs, many people got sick, many others died. Innocent victims were gunned down in the streets, caught in the crossfire between rival gangs.

    Ring any bells?

    The government and police efforts at stopping people enjoying their JD was funded, as always, by the tax-payer. The situation, as it is now, simply doesn’t work. It can be argued that prohibition causes more harm than good. This is mainly because the trade is unregulated.

    Drugs are frequently mixed with other chemicals, even rat poison, by criminals looking to increase their profits. A scumbag isn’t asking for I.D. when a young kid comes looking for his fix. How can this scenario possibly be deemed preferable to the legalisation, regulation, and taxation of recreational drugs.

    Your comment that, “THESE DRUGS ARE DANGEROUS AND 100%ADDICTIVE,” illustrtates to me how uninformed you are concerning these substances and also supports the theory that your argument is primarily emotionally driven and pays little attention to the facts. Perhaps it is you who needs to “GROW UP AND GET REAL.”

    So, what is the reality? For a start, whether they are illegal or not, people are not going to stop taking recreational drugs. This is something which you need to realise and accept before any intelligent debate can be had on this issue. Prohibition has not worked in the past, is not working now, causes many of the problems that we see today and is extremely expensive and difficult to implement.

    Finally, there is no easy solution to the problem. To continue with the current laws, however, in the face of all the evidence, is completely irrational.

  94.  

    I mustn’t have explained this clearly enough last night.

    I will do a post about the merits of legalising drugs in the near future.

    This post isn’t the place for that discussion.

    Please, folks. Respect that decision or I’ll have to start moderating your comments.

  95.  

    Apologies Bock.

    I look forward to your post.

  96.  

    Bock asks, rhetorically, why we put up with all this nonsense from tinkers. I did arts in UCD in the early Eighties, we shared the same faculty building as Social Science. There were hundreds of these well meaning types graduating every year. We (or rather you, ‘cos I buggered off) had nobody for these graduates to represent except tinkers. It was prejudiced of us to expect them to sign on at the same Dole Office week in, week out, they’re ‘travellers’ after all. So they didn’t sign on elsewhere, they signed on everywhere. Are you old enough to recall the attacks on out of the way households in the west of Irealnd, when old people were tortured and killed for a few pathetic quid? How long before you realised that the perpetrators were travellers? The news – Radio Na Gaelatachta being an honourable exception – said the attackers were from the ‘North’. Not, ‘tinkers from the North’ mind you.
    OK, I know a lot of the trouble in Limerick stems from British born tinkers. A good denfense in court at the time was, ‘Drink had been taken, The defendant promises to go to England if Your Honour doesn’t jail him.’ Looks like the chickerns have come home to roost. I won’t be joining them, even for a holiday.

  97.  

    Decco, I don’t think Bock meant travellers, in fact I know he didn’t. Tinkers are something else completely.

  98.  

    I worked with Shane till last friday. Will be having a bottle of buckfast later for you my friend !
    If the police canont arrest these people for this, can they not stare at them ,follow them , piss on there door step, sit outside the dole office ,follow everysingle movement like what they done too Martin Cahill. pester them …………… fuck it, just castarate them

  99.  

    Nostalgia for the old ‘tinker’ notwithstanding, I don’t really think there’s much of a living to be made going around mending pots and pans. Assuming you accept the old chestnut about knackers being the dispossessed gentry who were forced onto the road,(rather like the Revolutionary France Aristos who became cobblers) their progeny are the ones wreaking havoc. In case we get too bogged down in terminolgy (knacker, tinker, traveller etc) – Have you ever stopped off in a place for a pint and found all the pubs closed because of a funeral? The ones the publicans are trying to avoid but can’t refuse, well, they’re the ones I mean. You can call them what you will.

  100.  

    Travellers? Tinkers?

    The McCarthys were known for generations as tinkers even though they never travelled.

    Did you know that? The McCarthys never travelled an inch and therefore were not and are not Travellers with a capital T. But they were always tinkers, that’s for sure. Especially when their men and their women beat each other at night on Mungret Street and the whole town watched their crazy behaviour.

    But at least in those days we were able to laugh them off as nutcase tinkers, unlike now, when they’ve made serious money from crime and have quasi-traditional rights accorded to them by well-meaning idiots.

    Did you know there’s no clear definition of a Traveller in law?

    Why do I mention the law, you might ask?

    Simple. It’s because so many people take refuge in their legal status as Travellers when claiming discrimination and defending their traditions.

    Nobody asks them to prove it, and it’s about time somebody in a court of law asked the hard question. Where’s your evidence that you’re a member of the Travelling community?

  101.  

    i must say i enjoy your site and respect the manner in which you keep your bloggers focused and prevent the deviation which can occur.
    we can denigrate “the system” all we like and there is plenty to denigrate, but most unfortunatly its all we have, and all change for the future will hang precariously in our choice of balance, therefore it will be largely down to all of us……the people taking the time and interest on these pages, not to get demoralised and hopeless, but to continue to share positive and constructive ideas and information that will execute change, it is beyond description that the unspeakable savagery perpetrated in limerick should be forgotten while we become reconsumed with our own commitments and survival, we must create a space in our own lives to make our contribution for change.
    one thing that continues to pass through my mind, i remember many moons ago, when small time “drug users” were brought before the courts, recieving fines, probation acts etc for what now seems like “small time” consumption, that never happens now, i suppose the court system is inundated with bigger fish to fry, but the laws which were introduced back then as in designating jail time for amounts of drugs does not appear to ever have been implempted appropriatly, before i drift, my point is, the courts hear cases of drug dealing amounts but it is the “clients” who come from all walks of life and all areas of social strata that are keeping the “murdering scumbags” in business, maybe the system should rewind so that the “clients” at least the younger ones, who may still have a modicum of regard for the consequences meeted out by their parents just might garner a little awareness of what they are contributing to, take the young “respectable clients” out of their “comfort zone” and give their parents something to think about on their way to the courthouse…….controversial? maybe even impossible? the situation has gone so far now it has to be dragged back into ever household wherein resides a recreational drug user of any amount or any type….and from there increase the awareness of this vile pervasive culture which may end up on any of our doorsteps.

  102.  

    Jst one response for Jumper…. My comments are to do with hard drugs. There is nothing re-creational about heroin or crystal meth. Think about it. Re create….. recreational. These drugs destroy the body and mind they do not re create it…… that may be a play on words to you but its very real to me. And anyone who has ever tried to get over addiction will tell you that the substance causing the addiction whatever it may be does not re – create you.
    We need to unite against all dealers. Then Shane will not have died in vain.

  103.  

    p.s. I agree totally with stledger norma.

  104.  

    My thoughts are with the Geoghegan family and friends. Words cannot fill the depth of loss you must be feeling. I’m truly sorry.

    HGF

  105.  

    i wrote a comment on “limerick blogger” to-day on shanes murder, because i fear hopelessness or complacence might creep in, i would hope the least we might do is keep the ” thread ” alive.
    i have reread some of my comments and i could’nt blame anyone for thinking i am devoid of a sense of humour.
    lately, i have found, my family and i seem to be overusing the word “scumbag” such a vile word but so fitting, what could be worse, so i have started calling my daughter a “scumbag” firstly because she constantly robs my fags and socks……without impunity, and secondly because we live a long way from shops selling the offensive things….fags and also because i am really trying to find a meaning for that word which sits comfortably with me, i suppose its reasonable for me to reveal i am a parent and the whole drugs issue was something i was aware of, i made it very clear to my kids that i was on zero tolerance on the subject but totally open to discuss anything they needed to, without judgement or punishment, however, were i ever to discover that any of them imbibed in substances, then they would’nt have to wait for a knock on the door, i promised to personally deliver them to the lawful guardians of our society, this message was not delivered in fear but out of cognicence and regard for perpetration and the consequences thereof. apart from the obvious needs we as parents need to provide for our children, one is guardianship, how can we deliver that if we don’t know where they are or what they are doing? i don’t mean being authorativly invasive, i just mean the day in day out reaching out and communicating with love and trust.
    i am also quite obviously not a “young one” and my memories of “student and social revolution” might not be to the forefront of my life, neither are they entitly dormant, its people who effect change, not governments or legislators but us poor aul irish have gotten tired, rich, fat and very very complacent, there must be some out there with an appetite for change?…..i will continue my search for the true meaning of “scumbag” and try to refrain from calling my kids names….only joking

  106.  

    If these people didn’t have the drug trade, they’d have something else. Stolen cars. Illicit booze. Prostitution.

    It doesn’t matter what their business is.

    They’d be dangerous low-life psychopaths no matter what kind of living they made.

  107.  

    too true bock, but these phychos have leached their way into so many peoples lives, on many levels, if ireland were france it would be dealt with, again on so many levels, why? because french governing bodies are aware that their dependency on the electorate is real, the french will not lie down under threat or dictatorship or platitudes from their ministers……if limerick was a similar town in france the population would bring that town to a close until action was taken, what will we do? we might just wait until one of these gangs is rehoused next door to an irish minister, its not as unbelievable as it sounds, way things are going it could happen

  108.  

    On reading the blog of one “Branedy”, I wanted to respond by offering people a true impression of Shane

    http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=BcHIoqqxy4U

    I appreciate your educated replies to the lunacy of that uninformed idiot & hope this video might portray Shane in the light he deserves!

  109.  

    Hypocritical Irish Scumbags

    2 very simple Google searches tell you all you need to know about the hypocritical Irish people in 2008.

    Google Search pages from Ireland: Shane Geoghegan

    Results 1 – 10 of about 37,300 for Shane Geoghegan. (0.18 seconds)

    Google Search pages from Ireland: Brian Rossiter

    Results 1 – 10 of about 8,030 for Brian Rossiter. (0.09 seconds)

    Wealthy Dead Rugby players from Limerick are FAR more important to the Irish Hypocratia than Poor Dead 14 year old’s killed by Gardai in a cold cell in Clonmel

  110.  

    Dan Sullivan

    Bock, it might sound like a crazy idea but I think we should be able to revoke the citizenship of the people involved, drop in them a currach outside our territorial waters and let them row to some place that will take them. Citizenship comes with responsibilities as well as rights.

    No Dan – it’s not a crazy idea – it’s worse than that Danny Boy,

    It’s a bleedin’ retarded idea

  111.  

    Hubris — Where did you get the idea that Shane Geoghegan was wealthy?

    Is that because you thought all rugby players are rich? Are you bringing some East-coast prejudices to this discussion?

    I’d remind you, by the way that this post is not about Brian Rossiter, so please have some respect and don’t try to drag it around to what you want to talk about.

  112.  

    My apologies Bock – I did not mean to be disrespectful to the memory of Mr Geoghegan – it’s just that I’m findin the hypocrisy a little neauseating.

    I DO understand how people can get very militant in the wake of the behaviour that lead to the tragic death of Mr Geoghegan – BUT at the same time I find myself grasping for reasons to explain the almost deafening silence amongst the ‘plain people of Ireland’ regarding the death of the 14 year old boy.

    The only reason I can come up with is that they really don’t care when it is the Gardai that kill people – the unspoken consensus seems to be that anyone that dies in Garda custody might have deserved it – especially if they come from the wrong side of the tracks.

    _Is that because you thought all rugby players are rich?_

    NO – I played Rugby and was not rich. But compared to Brian Rossiter, Shane Geoghegan most certainly was. BTW: I said ‘wealthy’ – not ‘Rich’.

    _Are you bringing some East-coast prejudices to this discussion?_

    You’re presuming a lot there yourself now Monsieur Bock

    I’m surprised you can’t see how the criminals disrespect for the law is tied to Garda and Politician’s disrespect for the law.

    Why would any one seriously expect those people you call scumbags to obey the law when no one seems to make any serious demands that the Gardai and the politicians do?

    Do you not see how those two things might be connected?

    Irish society ignores the possible (I have to put that in there for legal reasons I suppose) very serious crimes of Gardai, or other ‘connected’ people (lawyers Politicians etc) – just like we ignored the sexual abuse carried out in our institution for years – no one cared because it was happening to the marginalised in our society – people that might have ‘deserved’ it by virtue of some flaw in their characters such as being born into gross poverty.

    That abuse would not have been possible without the conivance of so-called pillars of the community.

    Tons of outrage (and rightly so) for Mr Geoghegan – calls of ‘string ’em up’ etc.

    Yet curiously none for a 14 yr old that may have been killed by the Gardai – I have yet to see any letters to any newspapers calling for us to ignore the civil rights of certain Gardai. No one has suggested stringing up any Gardai that may have been (legalese again) involved in Rossiter’s death. (not that I would support that)

    One law for the ‘scum’ but a very different legal system operating for the ‘connected’ ones – how the hell do Irish people expect to have a decent society under those conditions?

    Any one here remember any Gardai going to jail for serious breaches of the law while on duty?

    No – didn’t think so

    Has the CAB raided the premises of any of the Politicians mentioned in the various tribunals?

    No- didn’t think so. (ok Ray Burke got lifted – what he did as a working Politician.)

    The difference in attitudes is astounding, IMO.

    It is Knee-jerk reactionism that has got us to this point. Half-measures and empty platitudes.

    Brown envelopes for Politicians to make terrible planning decisions that leave massive social chaos in their wake. West Dublin, and many other parts of this island, is a social and planning nightmare for the future – directly the result of those brown envelope shenanigans of the politicians – how many of them are in jail now?

    In what universe does a society function properly when there is very obviously one law for the ‘connected’ and a very different one for all others? Can you tell me that please, if you know?

    If all you want are commenters that scream ‘hangin’s too good for them’ then I’ll shut up – Maybe what Ireland and Limerick needs is an even bigger Amen-Chorus – but to be honest it doesn’t appear to have done ye much good so far.

    I even saw one commenter called for castration, for F sake – how the hell would THAT solve anything – why not go the whole way and publically garrotte all poor people that break any law. Break the legs of tax evaders – kill the kids of all poor people that we even suspect might break the law in the future, and we won’t have to worry how they turn out. Why take half-measures??

    Sorry – I’m ranting a little – but what we have now is hysteria surrounding this whole issue – and hysteria is never a good thing when deciding on changes to law that may have very serious and far reaching consequences for our already dysfunctional society, I think you will agree

  113.  

    I’m presuming nothing. I just asked a you question.

    If you have a look around this site, you’ll see that there’s a great deal written about the gardaí, crooked politicians, AND Brian Rossiter. However, there’s a place and a time for everything.

    As regards the skobes who killed Shane Geoghegan, I’m not sure if you know exactly what we’re dealing with.

  114.  

    Surely when everyone is proposing hangings or castration or ‘banishment from the realm’ etc it might be a good time to speak up regarding hysterical knee-jerk reactions, no?

    Don’t you remember the infamous Garda ‘Heavy Gang’ of the ’70’s?

    They stopped that for good reasons, you know.

    So – sure go hang a few – and then someday someone will go too far and hang or torture some innocent – or some 14yr old will get kicked to death (allegedly) in a dank cell somewhere deep in the bowels of a Garda station. – Oh, wait – that’s already happening NOW.

    You may not feel here is the place, Bock, but it definitely is the time.

    As regards the skobes who killed Shane Geoghegan, I’m not sure if you know exactly what we’re dealing with.

    Hmmm – you may be correct in your assumption, you may also think I’ve lived a very sheltered existence, bock – mayhap you think I’ve lived a cushy existance in a lovely quiet South Dublin Suburb?

    I travelled a lot. I’ve lived in high crime areas of several cities outside Ireland with bad reputations for drugs, general ‘run-of-the-mill violence’, and murder

    There’s a reason we have all these civil rights, Bock. People fought hard for them because of serious abuses in the past.

    I’m not willing to throw them all away just to satisfy what looks to me like a thirst for revenge. I may well be wrong on that – and maybe the extreme measures being called for are what is required – but somehow I doubt it.

    It didn’t work in the past so I think it’s likely to work now.

    How come other so-called civilised nations are able to deal with problems such as these without throwing away centuries of civil protections?

    What I do know is that is you give Police powers such as are being suggested then those powers WILL get abused.

    That probably won’t bother too many people until it happens to someone close to them – and I think that may be part of the problem.

    I’m sure Brian Rossiters father trusted the Police to act correctly when he left his son in their custody. That didn’t turn out too well, did it?

    I also KNOW that rational debate is called for, not hysterical knee-jerk reactions to satisfy a thirst for revenge. Bad law is made through hysterical reactions and the desire for quick fixes. I suspect that’s how things got so bad in the first place.

    The sex-laws brought in by McDowell a few years ago are a perfect example – they just caused more problems than they solved.

  115.  

    Hubris
    Can you not pay more attention to Bock…. he’s already suggested that “there’s a great deal written about the gardaí, crooked politicians, AND Brian Rossiter”, so can you not take your arguement to those areas of this site,that is if you cant offer empathy in the light of Shanes murder. As regarding Shanes ‘wealth’, I feel you’re not in the position to figure his wealth! having known Shane since he was 12, I know he fought for everything he attained in life! To say he was wealthier than Brian Rossiter is almost common sense as a 28 year old is bound to amass a greater amount than a 14 year old…. but when Shane was 14, his life was in a different place and now, just like Brian, its gone!

  116.  

    ok

  117.  

    Hubris — It’s plain that you don’t realise I’ve already thought of all the angles and implications you mentioned. However, I’d ask you to give us credit for having a small bit of intelligence. Many of the points you mention have already been emphasised elsewhere on this site.

    Could you also try to be a small bit less didactic please? Many of us are quite old and quite experienced, and, much to your surprise, may already have stumbled on these insights before you did.

  118.  

    interesting choice of title hubris, in ancient greece hybris was considered a crime……hubris, excessive pride, arrogance, such traits were seen as inciting violence on others or on the person exhibiting said traits

  119.  

    Hubris, I am going to be devils advocate……you said …. the police “May” have been involved.
    Yet you feel you can castigate them on a possibility? What about their
    rights to be innocent til proven guilty? a bit of double standards
    there perhaps?

    The circumstances and events leading up to Brians stay in the
    garda station are in the public domain and may well have impacted on
    his health to such an extent that they may actually have been the
    cause of his death… Who knows? Neither you nor society can judge
    without expert witness.
    However what happened to Shane is very clear. Drug dealing feuding
    families shot the wrong person.
    Its not fair to the memories of either of these two persons to
    start comparing deaths, and its unfair to automatically implicate
    anyone in a death without evidence and fair trial.

  120.  

    What do you think old Hubris did after lecturing us?

    In a monumental act of hubris, not to mention bad manners, he lifted my piece on Brian Rossiter in its entirety and reposted it on his own site, HERE, as part of something he was writing.

    Jesus Christ, some people are very badly brought up.

  121.  

    Have you read the disclaimer at the bottom of the post. He basicly says he doesn’t necessarily support his own views, if I understand correctly. Bit odd that but perhaps I misunderstood.
    A bit of bad form there qouting the entire post. He didn’t even mention the name of the site.

  122.  

    Many of the points you mention have already been emphasised elsewhere on this site.

    Oh I see – I have to read the whole of your site before I dare comment on anything – oh well thanks for the tip – I’d suggest, purely to forewarn almost every other user of the internet that might even contemplatecommenting on any of your posts, that you might consider putting a notice to that effect in future – I mean unreasonable demands should at least be announced beforehand so they might not seem totally pathetically unreasonable to anyone that might not meet your apparently stringent criteria.

    What do you think old Hubris did after lecturing us?

    I did it while I was ‘lecturing’ you, actually
    I simply tried to raise things I thought were relevant – I was told you didn’t want to hear – so I peacefully left – so now I’m ‘lecturing’? – jesus your like a pissed of kid in a playground – ‘It’s MY ball, so I say what the rules are’ – grow the fuck up – what are ya, 12?

    In a monumental act of hubris, not to mention bad manners, he lifted my piece on Brian Rossiter in its entirety and reposted it on his own site, HERE, as part of something he was writing.

    I lifted all of it because I felt is was ALL worth quoting. Most people would take that as a compliment – obviously I hadn’t factored in that there was an ego like your’s to feed.
    My god – are you so peeved that I dared disagree with you that you start making shit up?

    The bit I lifted was linked direct to your site – It was also blockquoted on my page so as to show it was NOT my writing. I know plenty of bloggers, bock, and I happen to know you’re talking shite – I don’t need to you to teach me anything about the intarwebs Bock,

    If I’m guilty of anything it is that I didn’t mention you by name in the post –

    I really don’t understand your need to make shit up bock – I didn’t realise a direct link to your site was not enough and and that your ego required a name drop – I’ve linked to and conversed with many other bloggers out there – you’re the first that ever had a problem – I guess the others didn’t need their ego’s stroked in quite the same way you appear to.

    I had intended to leave you alone as I had been requested, I clearly signalled that by merely replying ‘ok’ to R. Cullinane.

    But for some reason you then feel you need to not only ‘get the last word in’ (which I don’t really mind – it’s your blog) but also to make false charges at the same time – which is pathetic, frankly

  123.  

    So I won’t bother to comment in future, which I’m sure will make you happy- so you can now proceed to all gather round lil’ ol’ bock there and stroke his ego by assuring him how correct he is, and he can make some more crap up to soothe his massive and apparently wounded ego.

    Goodnight kiddies – I’ll leave the sandpit all to you

  124.  

    We’re looking at a man with serious anger problems there, in my opinion. Serious and debilitating personality problems.

    Wouldn’t you love living under his roof?

  125.  

    -Hubris
    You’re a fine one to go calling other people children. Just go and read your response to my comment on your site. You sound like a fucking enfant. It’s Irish society’s fault, perhaps, but you’re part of irish society as much as anyone else.
    But you know what, just to prove I’m not one of Bocks boys, I’ll violate part his comments policy;
    You are a fucking tool. You’re a stuck up, small minded fuck who points the finger of blame at all and sundry without looking at himself first. Fuck you, and the horse you rode in on.
    Why don’t you copy and paste that for your site, you tosser.

  126.  

    The knob polisher took my advice The poor attention starved gobshite.

  127.  

    Let’s not contaminate this thread with any more of that guy’s nonsense. We’ll move on, if that’s ok.

  128.  

    Fair enough. More fool me for letting him get a rise.

  129.  

    Bock your government failed you for years by getting rich off these criminals. Get rid of free legal aid and let them pay their own expenses then lets see how smart they are when they face a bill in excess of a million Euros. They cost us more.

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